ColinJonesPodcast.mp3:

Speaker1:
How’s it going? I think we are alive. I am here with Colin Jones. If you are catching us live. Say hi. If you’re catching this on replay-type replay. So I know that you’re seeing it. I catch this on replay, mute that. There we go. We should be live. And we do have some people watching us already. So make sure you say hi. You’re catching us live. If you’re catching this on replay type replay so that we know that you are here. You are watching a live recording of a podcast today. We’re interviewing Colin Jones, who’s the CEO of the Society of Photographers, based out of. Liverpool. I almost opened it again and I was like, No, no, it’s 4 hours north of London.

Speaker2:
Yeah, sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker1:
There we go. There we go. All right. So so if you are catching this on replay, tape, replay, right, the day and time that you see it so that we know that it’s still being seen and it’s bumping in the algorithm. If you’re joining us live, say hi. And if you have any questions, just type them in the comments. I’ll make sure I come back to them at the end of the podcast. So we’re going to go ahead and I’m going to get this file up so I can read it. All right. So I’m going to just go ahead and I’ll read your bio first and then and then I’ll start by introducing myself. That way they can cut the bio whenever they produce the podcast. Having been brought up in photography and from a very young age, I’d been involved with running photographic organizations. Colin Jones has a unique perspective in a large knowledge of the photographic industry, with particular emphasis on the trade side of the industry. As CEO of the societies of photographers, Colin’s role is to oversee the day-to-day running of the organization from membership recruitment renewals, to expanding and updating the benefits of membership. London Photo Convention Organiser Heading up the roadshows team providing content and part, designing the magazine professional image-maker, website design and content creation as well as business development. Colin also works closely with the trade to help them reach photographers through advertising and trade shows. This enables the societies of photographers to provide free education and training for photographers out of hours. Colin is immensely proud to be a volunteer crew member for Real RNLI Lifeboat Helping Save Lives at Seas. His roles on the station include deputy mechanic and navigator on the all-weather lifeboat and helm on the inshore lifeboat. Colin is also an acoustic musician playing acoustic-style gigs in his local area around North Wales, as well as releasing original music on Spotify, iTunes, and Amazon music. Hello guys. My name is John Smith and I’m here with Colin Jones. I’m super excited to have you here with me. Thank you so much for joining us today.

Speaker2:
It’s amazing to be invited. Thank you so much for having me.

Speaker1:
Of course, it’s so good to see you. We’ve been kind of chatting back and forth over email, so it’s an over a DM, I guess. So it’s great to have you here and you’re a little bit ahead of us, so I appreciate you joining us at the end of our workday and accommodating our Eastern Time zone over here.

Speaker2:
So thank you. It’s a fantastic way to end the weekend to chat with you about all things photographic. So I’m looking forward to it.

Speaker1:
I love that. So you are the CEO of this organization in London and I have to say I don’t know much about it. I know how, you know, photography organizations run here in the States, but I don’t really know much about how they run in other countries. So I have a bunch of questions about that and I’d love to know some of the differences. And when I think about trade shows, I know you do. You do roadshows, too. So I’d really like to kind of talk about that because I think that’s a really cool idea. So tell me first about about the organization, like what it is, how it started.

Speaker2:
Sure. So the sizes of photographers, we we help photographers with their photography to improve their photography and help them build a more profitable and premium business with a list of benefits of membership. So just to kind of put it down in a nutshell, so we’re we’re not taking up too much time. We offer services like we do mentoring photographers, we run monthly image competitions, we have online networking places. So we’ve got an online forum, we’ve got members, Facebook group, so you can network with fellow photographers. We also have a qualification system over here so you can submit your work and get become a qualified photographer of our association. From the business side, we do online listings. We can link back to your website. We get discounts on products and services, business advice. We also do a lot of webinars which cost us over between the the helping photographers improve their photography and their business. We do a lot of help with marketing and stuff like that. So in a nutshell, yeah, we’re just here to support photographers, make better pictures and hopefully earn a bit more money doing it at the same time.

Speaker1:
That’s great. So how long when did it start? When did you did you did you build this or are you.

Speaker2:
Know, this was the originally the the sizes of Tom is one of his ways of being known as the WPP, which is the Society of Wedding and Portrait Photographers. That was actually devised by an association here in the UK called the Master Photographers Association. They were at the time they were full time photographers only were allowed to join. So if you’re a part time photographer, that was kind of no real place in the market for you to be able to join an association. So the MPAA at the time they made the WPP back in the late eighties and formed the WPP, my dad took that over in about two and 99, 1999, and then from there we’ve built it up. So now we have a fantastic range of photographers, not just by them portrait photographers, but we also have nature and wildlife photographers. We’ve got fashion photographers, commercial photographers, travel photographers and any kind of photographer in between. We’re we’re so fortunate to have a fantastic range of photographers within our membership. So it’s kind of built from that, which is why we’re now known as the Society of Photographers, because we started off as, as I say, just one in the portraits, and we’ve expanded out to become quite an all inclusive society.

Speaker1:
It’s a great name. I love it.

Speaker2:
It’s a tongue twister anyway.

Speaker1:
No, it’s a great name. It sounds very British. For those of us in the States, whenever I first thought I was like, Well, that is the perfect name for a station in the UK, but I love it. It’s a great name for it. So. How many photographers are in your organisation?

Speaker2:
So we have 5000 members as part of our association and as I say, they’re covering all different types of photography and also all around, all around the world. We’ve got photographers in Australia, America and all around Europe as you can imagine. So we’ve got a truly international membership as well, which is amazing. We get to see some amazing photography come from all around the world. When entered into our competitions, it’s it’s amazing to see.

Speaker1:
That’s amazing. So you hold a yearly conference.

Speaker2:
Sure.

Speaker1:
But then you also do roadshows, which I’ve never heard of this before. I started becoming involved in your organisation and I think it’s such a cool idea and as far as I know, I don’t think this happens here with any other organisations that we have here. So and people who are watching are listening. If you’re listening to podcasts or watching on YouTube. Correct me if I’m wrong, please. And I know people will do they will correct me. So I encourage it. But yeah. So tell me more about a road show. How many do you do? Like tell me about tell me all about it. I’m super interested in how this works.

Speaker2:
So I think the road shows that they’ve kind of a, they came from originally like the convention. So we run the photography convention, which is back when my dad was a photographer. We used to kind of spend all this year working towards making enough money to go over to WPP in Las Vegas. And that would be our our vacation, as well as a business trip at the same time. So kind of like as I mentioned in the bio, I’ve always been in associations since since I was a child really, you know, being dragged along to different expos and conferences around the world. But my dad’s favorite was always going over to WPP and we didn’t have anything like that in the UK at the time. It wasn’t something that was available in the UK, so that’s why we had to travel over to America to do that. So that’s where the kind of the our convention comes from and the ideas behind it came from WPP. But of course that’s just once a year and it’s down in London and it’s a great event. It’s a massive event, really big. But you kind of get the the throughout the year, you kind of miss that camaraderie of meeting of photographers and seeing the trade and getting the education. And so what we decided to do was take that onto the road. So we go around the UK and Ireland. So we do. We’ve done nine shows this year, we’ve done six so far and we’ve got three in a couple of weeks time and a set of three.

Speaker2:
And basically we just kind of go on like a mini tour. So we’ll start off in one place on a Tuesday and there’s free, free masterclasses for other days so photographers can come along and enjoy the education that’s available. And alongside that, there’s the trade show. So we have the likes of Canon and Sony and some of our retailers over here and some of the labs like lots of colour and digital art and one vision, they’re all they’re showing the later kind of products that are available for photographers. So they’re just fantastic days. And of course, once you get a bunch of photographers in one room, the networking opportunities are just amazing. You can see people really forming friendships in the industry, which is really vital. You know, it’s quite a small industry over in the UK and you know, a lot of photographers work on their own. So by forming these kind of friendships with local photographers, when you need a hand, so you’ve got a big event coming up, you need two photographers or you want to run some ideas, plus someone you know, having someone to bounce ideas off and all that kind of stuff, you know, that’s that’s a massive plus point to go in. So any photographic event, you know, everyone I’ve ever been to has been just so friendly and welcoming and open. So I’d really encourage people just to go to the local events. But yeah, that’s another reason why we do them, just to get people together and share in the passion of photography.

Speaker1:
So how many roadshows do you do a year?

Speaker2:
So we do nine, nine roadshows a year. Typically, as I said, we’ve done six already this year and we’ve got three more coming up. We normally spread them over 12 months, but because of everything that’s happened the last couple of years, we decided to start the year off really quick and get them all done and dusted and you know, just kind of get the photographic world back in the UK up and going again and getting photographers to see the latest products. There’s been some amazing launch and some really good products out during the last couple of years where we’ve not been able to get to see stuff. So getting out nice and early so we could show off these products has just been really, really good fun.

Speaker1:
So when you’re doing the road shows. Is it like multiple days or is it one day?

Speaker2:
Oh, yes, multiple days. So we normally do choose the Wednesday, Thursday. So we do the show in the day, travel at night, stay in a hotel, do the show the next day and travel on again to the next place. So it’s it’s quite a tiring week, but great to see so many people in one big go. And because we travel as a unit, so to speak, so we’ve got the the camaraderie of the trade at night. So it’s not just a case of being at the trade show in the day. We all follow each other and stay in the same hotels at night and get to meet up for dinner and drinks in the evening. Which which is brilliant as well.

Speaker1:
That’s awesome. So how many people typically come to the roadshows?

Speaker2:
So there are a lot smaller than the normal convention. We do so typically between 200 to 50, maybe 300 on a good one, photographers in one day, but they’re all at the idea of them. They’re meant to be nice local shows that you can get really you know meet your local photographers, meet your fellow colleagues and get the chance to really speak intimately with the trade and stuff like that. So yeah, so, so they’re great days. They really are.

Speaker1:
So then your main conference, your big conference, tell us when that is.

Speaker2:
So that’s our next one is in March. And I know you’re going to ask that I keep forgetting the date, but it’s it’s Wednesday the 15th, and so Saturday the 18th of March 2023. And it’s a fantastic four days all on education with big trade show lots going on. It’s a it’s a really great event. And that’s held in the Novotel in Hammersmith in London.

Speaker1:
That sounds amazing.

Speaker2:
It’s a brilliant event. You know, it’s pretty much like the conferences you guys get out in America that there’s so much going on. We have masterclasses, which I think you would classify as platform classes in the in the US. We also have two classes which are more intimate, 15 people. So you can do lighting and all you can do pose and and get really intimate and get the chance to direct people and have a go yourself. We also have 2516 competition which is judged live of the events. You can submit your 2516 prints, go along to the judge in and watch the judges critique and score on the images, which is just an amazing education experience. Everybody goes to watch. The judging comes back with lots of ideas, a real fantastic appreciation of the judging process and what the judges are really looking for when it comes to when they’re scoring those higher prints. You know, sometimes just the finer details is all it takes to take your image from a merit category up until the next outstanding or exceptional kind of categories. So that’s definitely so if there’s any judging in any, again, go back to your local places. No matter where you are in the world watching and tuning into this, then I would highly recommend going along to watch the judging process because it really is an eye opener. We also do a business school, so we do that. We’re really passionate about helping people build their business, so we have a full day all about business, not about photography. It’s all about building your brand and your business and making more profit. We have an awards dinner, the trade show and loads of social evenings in between, so it’s a fantastic event.

Speaker1:
That sounds amazing. So how many people typically come to the conference?

Speaker2:
So for that one, on a good year, we have about 10 to 15000 photographers turn up for that one.

Speaker1:
Ten, 15.

Speaker2:
Yeah, 10 to 15000. So yeah, it’s, it’s a really big event.

Speaker1:
I was for some reason I was thinking it was like 1000 because I picture it being very small there.

Speaker2:
So it’s kind of is but we krump everyone in and the hotel where we run the the event it’s it’s got the trade show on one floor all the classes are on the next floor. And as soon as you come out of both of them, you head into the bar area. So you can’t fall out of the hotel without passing the bar area, which is just an amazing place. As soon as you go into the area, you can just imagine it’s a room full of photographers and everyone is so welcoming. So if you’ve not been before, then I’d highly recommend it. And just people say, Oh, you know, I’m going on my own. I’m a bit nervous. And I say, Well, just the person’s laughed at you and say, Hello, where are you from? What kind of photography you do? And no doubt they’ll invite you into that group and you can enjoy the evening with them. It’s everyone’s so welcoming and friendly. It’s, it’s a brilliant place to go to.

Speaker1:
It sounds amazing. And it’s London. I can’t imagine most people, I think in the States if they haven’t been they once ago, that’s one of the places where I think probably most of us, if we haven’t been, we want to go. So so I shoot boudoir full time and I teach business and marketing as primarily and so. So how what is your take on like the boudoir world in the UK. I have. Lots of students actually that are in the UK, Australia. That cute boudoir. But I’d love to know like your overview. Like, is it like an up and coming genre there? Is it a genre that is a little bit harder to break into? What is your feel on that particular?

Speaker2:
My my gut feeling with that is it’s quite a strong area of the market in the UK. To be fair, I think it’s. I don’t think that’s changed over the years. I think it’s always been a fairly a strong, strong part of the market. I remember when my dad was a photographer back in the nineties, he he was doing different types of fashion and I don’t feel like that for clients will want to maybe boudoir sessions although it might not have been called boudoir back in those days. I think the terminology might change in between. But even back when my dad ran his studio, it was still a very popular area of the market. And I think it’s it’s always been strong. There’s lots of photographers over here in the UK that shoot boudoir and fashion and I can’t see that changing. I think it’s always going to be a strong, strong market for photographers.

Speaker1:
Yeah, I agree. It’s I think it was one of the few genres that was not affected by COVID here in the States. I mean, we were affected a little bit. I mean, there was about three months where I shut down. But then after that, once we were allowed to work again, I was I actually made more because people had a lot more disposable income. They weren’t going on vacations, they weren’t going out to eat. They really weren’t going shopping because they were at home. So business was really strong for boudoir photographers, especially during that time. So it’s good to hear that it was probably the same there.

Speaker2:
Yeah, I think so. I think I mean, I think the only thing that’s probably changed over the years in the last 15 years, maybe it’s just the style of it, you know, I suppose that’s that’s with every type of photography style. It has changed over the years. But I mean, that’s the only thing I can really think of. You know, the market’s always kind of been there. And as I said, it’s always been a strong market. I’d say the only thing that really has changed is just the the style of it. You know, I suppose when we go back and look at any photo from the mid nineties, we will look at it now, but there you go. But yeah, no, it’s good.

Speaker1:
So I can’t help but think. I wonder if our dads came across each other in their travels because my dad was also a photographer in the eighties and nineties, a really good one. He actually won the photographer wedding photographer of the Year from at WPI in 1983. So I actually went to a lot of these conferences with him, too, as a child.

Speaker2:
So no way. Well, possibly we’ve crossed paths as we were running through the the expo halls as kids, maybe. I don’t know.

Speaker1:
So I’m sitting here wondering that as you’re talking. But yeah, it’s it’s crazy like how, you know, kind of the itch, I think. Friends and the family sometimes.

Speaker2:
Sure. Yeah. I mean, my WP days go back to when it was back in the Sands Expo Centre. So that’s kind of when I first started to go in and then Tropicana and all those kind of ones. So yeah, did quite a few of them over the years.

Speaker1:
Yeah. His he won it was at Caesar’s whenever he.

Speaker2:
Oc.

Speaker1:
Back in the day. It was a long time ago but yeah. Yeah. So did you. Do you shoot too. Do you run. Is this a full time running this organisation.

Speaker2:
Sure. So, so my full time job is, is running the association and I really see myself as I’m that to enable photographers to enjoy their photography and to, to build, you know, to take bad pictures and build their, their skills and their knowledge on photography and hopefully build a better and more profitable business. That’s where I see my myself. So I don’t I don’t actually shoot myself. Although I’ve always been in the photography industry, my granddad was photographer, my dad was a photographer and pretty much all my working life I’ve been in the industry. But yeah, I see myself as there to help photographers rather than than shoot myself. And as you said in my bio, when you’re reading out before my hobby is outside of work or photography as I work, I’m a volunteer for the night, which is like the Coast Guard’s up here for you. And so that’s going to see we don’t do customs in the great immigration like and stuff. We’re just there as a search and rescue service. Wow. And then I’m also an acoustic musician, so I go out and I play gigs in the local pubs and clubs and that’s kind of like my distraction at the weekends. So that’s good fun as well.

Speaker1:
That’s great. So I’m sure you have you probably know so many experienced photographers and you’ve probably come into contact with so many very successful people. One thing that I get asked a lot by photographers is what piece of advice do you have for new photographers? So I always like, I guess. Asking people I interview what is the best piece of advice you have for new photographers? And then the best piece of advice for photographers who are in it, like running a business full time, like in in the weeds with it. What is your best advice for both?

Speaker2:
So anyone new to the industry and just getting into photography. My advice is is solidly get education, invest in good education, not just only in in photography but in business as well. You know, it’s something that we see quite often. You know, it’s something that we’re really passionate about is seeing people invest in their training. And within a short space of time, they’re getting to where they want to be as a photographer rather than taking the hard route or trying to learn it all by yourself and make the mistakes that so many people have made in the past. You can take that shortcut and get to where you want to be a lot quicker. If you invest in that, that training with the right people, you know, go out and find somebody who you enjoy that photography or the way they market themselves or whatever it may be and invest in their training platforms. You know, there’s plenty out there to choose from. So going to have a good look around and and do that so that and also join in some fun. I know it sounds like my own back here, but joining an association, whether that’s a local one or one like ourselves, which is an international or WPI or PPA or whatever it may be an association and get involved. Associations are very much like a gym membership. You can pay your gym membership and never turn away and you don’t get any fitter or you can pay and turn up every week and you start to see a real difference with your fitness and all that kind of stuff.

Speaker2:
And it’s exactly the same with associations. You can pay to be a member and get nothing from it, or you can pay, get really involved and you’ll see the fruits of all that labor going into your photography and hopefully, as I say, improving your photography and and your business. For people in the in the thick of it and already been a photographer for a long time. Again, I think education is still really important. I think having a continual professional development program is something that’s really important to to any business, whether it’s photography or or anything else out there, you know, investing in that, whether it’s, you know, new trends to the market, business is changing so rapidly. And in fact, we were just talking about it just before we we went live with the podcast was, you know, you’re looking at different social media platforms like TikTok or Instagram and stuff like that, and they’re changing so rapidly then I think education has always been in the game. 20, 30 years is still really important and it might not be that you need the the education on lighting or posing or something like that. It might be just keeping up to date with the local, you know, the new social media networks. And so that and.

Speaker1:
That’s a master class in itself.

Speaker2:
So yeah, of course there’s yeah. And you know, we’ve done lots of webinars about social media and how to best utilize different platforms. And, you know, we haven’t even scratched the surface of it. We’ve just had a very brief outlook you and that’s that’s powers of content. So yeah, you’re exactly right. It’s it’s a masterclass on its own, just learning to be an Instagram, you know, very good on that and getting business from it. So yeah, there’s always opportunities for self improvement and no matter where you are on the on the journey of photography.

Speaker1:
Something that shocked some of my students the other day as I told them that I actually had hired a coach to coach me for TikTok, I needed a social media manager because it got to the point where I was just getting exhausted, coming up with new content, and I needed someone to help me. So I’ve been working with her since March probably. And sometimes you just even like coaches need coaches, you just need someone sometimes to be like, Hey Jen, you’re not doing what you need to do. Like, Come on, let’s go. You know.

Speaker2:
100%, you know, that goes back to what I was just saying before. No matter where you are on your journey, you know, there’s always somebody who can give you a fresh perspective or a different outlook and all that kind of stuff. So even if you have been in the industry, you know, we’re saying before when it comes to like boudoir photography and stuff like that, you know, from the nineties to now, the style has changed quite, quite massively, really, you know, so you might have been a boudoir photographer for 20 years, but, you know, maybe that’s the training that you need to look at. What’s the new styles, what’s the what are the audience in your area expected and all that kind of stuff. Right. So there’s a. Insulin and lots of I’m really passionate about it is there is that continual education and improvement and self improvement and stuff like that.

Speaker1:
I love that. Well, let’s hop over to the Facebook group. I might get a ton of popping up. Oh, here we go. Just a few. All right. So we have a few comments here. Subaru said, how have I not heard of you? Call it the Subaru is amazing. She is an amazing photographer. Mark Lori said, hi, Colin, great to hear from you.

Speaker2:
Great to see you.

Speaker1:
Sue added I’m from the UK but live in the USA. Curious if there so Sue is a very talented photographer that does fetish kink erotica and so she’s curious if there’s any interest in the fetish kink erotica genre. Several UK photographers in my group, I would be interested in instructional educational opportunities.

Speaker2:
Okay, cool. Yeah. So some of our our members that have been in the association for a long time, that’s where they kind of started off. One name brings to mind is Damien McGillicuddy. He he shot all kinds of photography from newborn photography to commercial photography. But one of the biggest aspects that he was well known for was the kind of latex modelling side of photography, and that’s what he did for for many, many years. And it does lots of education on that.

Speaker1:
So I think also so when I think of like I guess photography in England, in England like UK in general, I think of like very prim and proper and like technical, just maybe because that’s like my cultural like, you know, idea of what that culture is over there. So I guess and I kind of touched on this when I asked about the popularity of Boudoir, but I think Sue is asking you more directly, like, is there a market for like kink erotica? You know.

Speaker2:
That 100%. You know, it’s it’s obviously not a the market is not as big as boudoir and stuff like that, but there’s certainly a niche market for it. And I can think of photographers over here that are doing just that and that that’s they’re they’re only kind of shown where they shoot. You know, there’s as you kind of say, you think everyone’s kind of like prim and proper. But I think it’s I think it’s as diverse over here as it is over in the in the States, to be honest. We’ve got some people that do shoot that very classical style of photography. We’ve got some people that shoot very, very modern or urban or everything in between. So yeah, there’s nothing that’s kind of like different overheads. What it is over there.

Speaker1:
That’s awesome. Yeah. I think, you know, there’s so many different facets to boudoir and people sometimes get very like focused in on like what is boudoir? But I think it’s great to just accept all the parts of it and that different people can really shoot different things. And Sue said, Yes, that’s what I’m asking. Some of my UK photographers seem a little afraid. It’s an emerging market, I think, and.

Speaker2:
I’d agree with that too, that yeah, I think that’s cultural change as well. That’s not just down to photography or that kind of stuff. You know, I think people, you know, in this society at the moment are becoming a lot more open minded and a lot more open to ideas. And even if it’s not something that they would particularly go down that route, you know, they can appreciate that some people would. So, you know, I think it is an emerging market. I know people myself that do that style of shooting quite well and, you know, and earn good money from it. So yeah, the possibilities are there.

Speaker1:
Yeah. I feel like in the US too. It is, it’s much less. Prevalent, I guess then now a lot of us get inquiries for it a lot, but and I assume and I haven’t had this conversation directly, but I would say maybe one out of every ten is an actual inquiry and then the other nine are just people not being very respectful. So I think that that’s, you know, the hard line like do they actually want to hire you or do they just want to like are they doing are they calling to inquire just for their own benefit? Yeah.

Speaker2:
Yeah.

Speaker1:
That’s the hard part to kink in erotica. And I think and I don’t know about photographers in the UK, but for me that’s my personal reason why I don’t even shoot it. Because for the amount of clients that actually hire me, there’s nine or ten more that. Aren’t doing it. And also too, I have a pretty big social media following. So I think sometimes like maybe I’m getting a lot more inquiries that are that because of that. But yeah, that’s super interesting. Does anyone else have any more questions that are Sue said, she said, lovely to hear such acceptance of evolving themes. Yes, absolutely. Gen one out of ten. Well, I’m glad I’m not the only one. And this is what Sue does and she’s extremely good at it. So. But. All right. Well, Colin, thank you so much for joining me today. It was so.

Speaker2:
Great. Thank you so much for having me. It’s great to to chat to you about photography and, you know, certainly what we’re doing over here in the UK. But seeing what similarities, I think the similarities between the UK and the US is quite close. The only thing is we’re usually a few, few years behind, like some of some of the ideas that the Americans are coming out with. We’re always on the catch up, but I think we’re getting we’re getting better and we’re getting quicker over in the UK, taking on new styles and new equipment and stuff like that. So it’s always great to chat about the differences between what it’s like over in the UK and the US.

Speaker1:
It’s been great having you. It’s so interesting hearing the different perspectives. I love it.

Speaker2:
Definitely, definitely. I’ve really enjoyed talking to you.

Speaker1:
Thank you. So, so if people want to follow you or they want to follow the societies, how do they find you? Where would they find you at show.

Speaker2:
So our website is the society’s dot map. You can follow us on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and I’m on LinkedIn as well. So normally if you just type in the societies or the sizes of photographers, then you can find us on there and please, please give us a follow on and the like. And if you’ve got any questions and please feel free to either either drop a comment in the video what’s on on the group. And I’m more than happy to answer or as a PM and I’m more than happy to answer that as well.

Speaker1:
Awesome. I’m going to close out the podcast, but stay with us for a few more minutes. Colin. We’re going to see if anyone else on Facebook has any questions. I’m Jen Smith. You can find me at the High Rollers Club on Facebook. You can find me at the High Rollers Club Bio, which is our website. We’re so glad to have Colin here with us from the Society of Photographers in the UK. Thank you so much for making time today.

Does the fear.

Speaker1:
Take you over?

You just can’t.

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